Author and journalist Cal Flyn joins Russ Roberts for a discussion about a question that feels increasingly urgent: what counts as wilderness in a world shaped by human activity almost everywhere. The conversation looks at the idea of the "wild" when billions of people share the planet and even remote landscapes are connected to modern life in some way.
The episode centers on how the meaning of wilderness has changed over time. Rather than treating wild places as completely separate from people, the discussion explores the complicated history behind landscapes often seen as pure, empty, or untouched. That framing challenges older assumptions about nature and forces a closer look at how humans define the places they admire most.
Flyn also examines why wild places still hold such power over the imagination. Even if truly untouched land is hard to find, the longing to step away from cities, systems, and everyday routines remains strong. The appeal of wilderness, in this view, is not only about geography but also about the human desire for distance, freedom, and perspective.
By linking environmental history with a broader cultural question, the conversation turns wilderness into more than a scenic ideal. It becomes a way to think about how people live on the planet, how they describe nature, and why the idea of escape from civilization continues to resonate.
